Discussion on Religion

Inevitably a discussion on anything with the majority of Alabamians returns to religion. On the heels of our political discussions my co-worker said it was a-ok to support war and killing, using a biblical perspective. Same setup as before. A bunch of questions and a bunch of “Uhmmmms”.“Do you support abortion?”

Hell no

“Why not?”

Because it is the taking of an innocent life!

“Innocents are not killed in war?”

Yes

“Then how is it that you can be fine with killing whomever in another country, but abortion is unbelievably wrong?”

Cuz it is.

(Not satisfied with the Cuz I said so argument I pressed. After all, if I wouldn’t accept that as an answer from my parents why would I now?)

At what point is the fetus to be considered alive? Directly to the point when is it “murder”?

At conception.

“At conception a fetus is no different than a pair of amoebas, parameciums (remember them?), or a tumor.”

Yeah but a tumor isn’t going to be a person.

“Granted, but at conception it is a grouping of cells, nothing more. As for myself I believe life starts when you take your first breath.”

How can you say that? Look at the images of sonograms kids sucking their thumbs etc.

“My perspective is Biblical in origin.”(Taken aback by this, he paused. He then asked for backup of my statements.)

“In Genesis it was not until Adam was given the “breath of life” from his Adonai did he become “man”. After all, it’s Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve right?”

He made mention, though he couldn’t exactly or indirectly quote, of a later verse in which God is professed to have “known” one of the prophets while still in his mother. I believe it was John, or an OT guy. I asked him to provide the same courtesy I had given him to back his argument up. He couldn’t so we moved on.

He made claim that all Muslims are out to kill all Christians. That we are in a state of war, and should live as such. Weapons at the ready locked and loaded.

“Have you ever heard of the Prayer of Saint Francis?”

Nope

“Well, it’s probably just a Catholic thing (saints).” So I recited it for him as I wished for quite awhile to be a Priest. Make me a channel of your peace…

He said he’d heard it somewhere before. I then asked if he felt that Jesus was his brother in the service of god. “Yes” Am I your brother? “Yes” Are all men on the planet your brother, in a biblical sense? “Yes” I asked him to hand me his keys. He obliged. I thumbed through to find the inevitable “WWJD” keychain. I asked him what Jesus would do today. “If he were a citizen of the United States in 2006, what would he be doing?”

I can’t answer that.

“Ok, (allowing him to wiggle out of that one) would he be arming himself?”

Probably not.

“Would he be bombing abortion clinics or school buses?”

No.

“Given what you know about the man, would you say that he, being a peace loving guy who hung around with “whores”, would support our nation’s foreign policies?”

Yes

“How?”

We support Israel.

“Yes we do. But the Israelites were the ones that killed him.”

Yeah, but he was Jesus so he forgave them.

“And so, what would Jesus do in response to 9-11?”

He probably would have forgiven them.

“Is this keychain of yours “WWJD” something to live by?”

Yes

“A maxim of sorts?”

Yup

“So, you hold a keychain that asks “What would Jesus do?” You’ve agreed that he would most likely be “soft” on terrorism or at the very least not support our foreign policies, you claim to live by the man’s examples of peace and fraternity …and you support war?”
Yup“You don’t see hypocrisy in that?”

Nope

I looked at his son who was still standing there waiting for his Dad to lay the smack down on this godless hippie freak which never happened. A light came into his eyes, and he breathed in so as to speak but held back as his eyes traveled to his Dad. His head ducked in silent obedience. He saw his father had just gotten his ass kicked again in an argument he felt to be his strong suit. We continued, and he related how the world was going to end soon, in his lifetime, and how great heaven’s going to be.

I asked him to remove himself from that thought process for one second (Believe me God won’t mind) is that a healthy process to guide our foreign policies? Well if it’s true, then yes. “What if it’s not true?”

Well, if you’ve read the bible in the New…

“Testament in the books of the Apocalypse it says, blah ditty blah. Name me one thing that was prophesized in the New Testament or old that has come true.”

Jesus was born as the Messiah.

“Well, the majority of the world’s population disagrees with that perspective. So, given that this world is going to end in our lifetime, our foreign policies should reflect that thought, even though it may not end in our lifetime? That’s being a little ignorant to the possibilities no?”

Maybe….

Then the owner yelled (not really) that we were extremely busy and we were not at Trinity College, my name isn’t Martin Luther and his wasn’t John Calvin…

And so I made people food to eat, and he cussed under his breath.
So for the rest of the night I sang the Prayer of Saint Francis to myself (it is a lovely poem) and asked myself what would Jesus do?

posted by Bacchus  # 12/01/2006 10:11:00 AM (3) Volleys | Trackback